Paper or plastic--a thing of the past?

A friend and I have been carrying on an exchange the last few days regarding the recent passage of an ordinance banning plastic grocery bags in San Francisco. With her permission I'm posting the discussion here for more open debate.

Her first post:

As you may or may not know, San Francisco has become the first U.S. city to BAN PLASTIC GROCERY BAGS!! Here's the news story:

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/03/27/environment.baggs.reut/index.html

Let's make Austin the second! What do you think?

My Reply:

I think if they did that i'd be out of poop bags for my dog! the solution isn't for the government to tell everyone what they have to do, its for people to tell companies what they're willing to take. if you want me to stop using plastic, you have to make an argument that convinces me to do so. I'm not personally convinced that cutting down trees to bag my groceries is any more ecologically friendly than plastic, especially when I have a secondary use for plastic bags that I don't have for paper. i have the same bitch about the smoking ban--its antithetical to a free state to tell private property owners what they can and can't do on their own property.

presuming that the argument that plastic is bad holds water (a point yet to be proven) a better strategy would be to make it less desirable for use, or alternatively and probably more attractive an option, make it less deleterious. for example, requiring a five-cent tax on plastic bags would be one way to make paper more attractive, though I'm of the opinion that a tax is almost as bad as an outright ban. perhaps a better solution would be to charge for them (maybe a dime a bag) and offer a rebate for returning them the way glass bottles used to be handled (say, 8 cents/bag). that way there's both an incentive to keep them out of the landfills and for companies to participate voluntarily. a third path would be to convince companies to make plastic bags out of biodegradable components that obviates the ecological argument against them.

at the end of the day though, it should still be my choice as a consumer, and my grocer's choice as a private enterprise, whether to use or offer plastic. plastic bags aren't exactly toxic waste, and they're made chiefly of byproducts of petroleum refining that would otherwise have to be disposed of, creating ecological problems someplace else. So the argument that my choice affects everyone regardless of their own choices doesn't really hold water.

And her response:

Thanks for the thoughts. I am all for a ban on plastic bags but I definitely see your point. I am not sure that paper would be the solution either but the fact is that plastic bags are the cause of more trash in Texas rivers, lakes, and shorelines than ANY other form of waste, they use petroleum, a resource that is becoming more and more valuable each day, and, contrary to popular belief, with the exception of a very inefficient and expensive process, plastic bags CANNOT be recycled and are not recycled, even in the places where the option is available. I think that in a city of such progressive and creative people such as Austin, we can think of better ways to take home our groceries. I am not sure that the private sector would be able to carry such an idea (excuse the pun) by charging for bags, etc. Most places already give you a discount for bringing your own bags but it is such a negligible amount and so unadvertised that it's not worth it to the average consumer. The government should represent the priorities of the people and in my opinion the environment should be a top priority for Austin.

I haven't responded to this last yet.